🎙️ 81. How to Optimize Your Office for a Promotion with Jacey Herbert

podcast

Jul 31

Written By Marie Groover

the spiritual 9-5 podcast transcript

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Episode Published on July 30, 2024

Transcript

Intro music 🎶

I believe that working can be one of the most spiritual paths that we walk. Whether that work is turning your passion into a business, or sitting behind a desk for 8 hours a day, or anywhere beyond and in between. And yet we often take the way in which we show up to work for granted, even though it's where we spend the majority of our time.

Here on The Spiritual 9–5 podcast, we talk about that. We talk about entrepreneurship. We talk about the 9-to-5. We talk about what it's like to be multi-passionate and talented and inspired and also utterly demotivated. We are here to support you in your work, whether your work is sacred to you or just something that you do to get by.

We are here to help you see and know yourself a little bit deeper, and to inspire you to show up no matter what it is that you find. I'm your host, Marie Groover, and like you, I am as multi-passionate as they come. I'm the founder of two businesses that are here to bring the soul back into the office. I, too, work a 9-to-5 in corporate tech. I'm a surfer, a writer, a philosopher-artist, if you will, and I'm so excited to bring you this episode today.

If you haven't, please leave the show a 5-star rating, and if this episode resonates, consider saving it and sharing it with someone you think it would resonate with, too.

Intro music fades 🎶

Marie Groover: Hi, Jacey.

Jacey Herbert: Hi!

MG: Okay, so we're here today to talk about Office Energetics. And Office Energetics in this context, I think, means two things:

Literally office energetics, the energy in an office, but then
It's an actual offering that we've co-created together, or a workshop, that provides guidance in a super light and fun setting for hybrid and remote teams to optimize their space, to optimize their desk, their offices for their personal and career goals.

It's a super unique offering that I am currently obsessed with. But I think it's really important for so many reasons. One of those being that companies spend so much money to create a vibe, or an energy, or a feeling when you walk into either a retail store, or a restaurant, or an institution, or an office space. And it's not spoken about a lot, but there's actually quite a lot of intention placed behind the design of most spaces that we walk into corporate spaces, including workspaces. And, you know, in the last few years we've shifted to include hybrid and remote workspaces, which are fast becoming the norm.

But what I think is missing is guidance and intention around the spaces that we keep and work within, most especially the ones that we are ourselves accountable for, like our home office, our desks at home, where we choose to work, how we choose to work. And so I wanna kick us off with all of that. And also this question of why Office Energetics? Really asking, you know, like, does your office, your desk, your workspace, or even just your home in general affect the way that you work? Do these things affect the way that you feel and the way that you show up and how?

JH: Yeah. I think absolutely they do, which is why we created this whole offering. I know you agree with me. We spend so much time at work. So much of our lives is working and feeling a sense of harmony while you're working is so important. And the way you feel at work bleeds into all other aspects of your life.

So you can be really good at compartmentalizing work, life balance, all of that. But in reality, when you're sitting at your desk and you're getting work done, you're still the same person as when you are when you go home, or when you're doing something else, or when you're out and making sure that you feel supported and at peace in your space, whether you're working, or sleeping, or in the kitchen is really important.

MG: Yeah. Oh, that's so good. This is such a good point. We do spend so much time working and the way that we feel at work, it so bleeds into everything else. I think about, you know, I had a friend over a couple of weeks ago and I was just kind of getting done with my workday as they were walking in the house. And I was totally, my energy was so different and that it took me, it took me a while almost to like decompress and be like, okay, I can be present with you, but I can can feel myself just being really intense and kind of weird, even though I didn't wanna be that way. And a lot of that came from the work. And so I'm curious, like, with Office Energetics or just, you know, even Home Energetics in mind, what are some things that we can do to create that feeling of harmony and peace when we're working?

JH: Okay so, when we're working, making sure that we have a designated workspace, that's something that's super important. You and I talk a lot about this in the workshops. It's something that I want all of our attendees to take home: is making sure that when you're working, you're working, and when you're living your life outside of work, you are living your life outside of work. And you're not thinking about work and work is not surrounding you. So to feel really supported while you're working, I think first to have, like, a designated space. So it’d be great if you had an office, if you went to the office, if you have a cubicle, or you just have a desk, or if you're at home working, that you have a place that's off to the side specifically for work. And being able to kind of close that down or leave that space when you move on into the rest of your life.

MG: Yeah. I love this.

JH: There's a bunch of other things we can do to feel supported while we're working. We can talk about chairs. We can talk about desks. We can talk about office equipment and the items that surround us as well. So that's something that we can get into if you want. Yeah. But I think having a designated space is number one.

MG: Yeah. Okay. Let's keep talking about this for just a second before we go into anything else because I think this is, this is interesting. You said being able to close that down, close your work down. And I, from doing the workshop with you, I kind of have an idea of what it is that you mean. And I wanna, I wanna emphasize this a little bit. You know, if I have a dedicated office and say this example of when I had a friend come over a couple weeks ago and I was, like, still in work mode, is something as simple as closing the door to my office, is that going to help me reset my energy? Is that gonna change the way that I feel? Well, first, I'll start with that question, and then and then I have another question.

JH: I would say yes. That's a great start. Another thing I like to do is change your clothes.

MG: Mmmm.

JH: That is something simple, even just like changing into a different top or changing into a different shoes or something if you're, you know, coming from work to home or just kinda shedding that layer of work off of your physical body really helps you in your mind transition to that other part of life.

MG: Oh, what a great tip. I did not know this one. Okay. So then what about when you have a dedicated space that maybe it's not an office? We're, we're just, like, diving in. I have so many other questions that are much more general, but it's fine. What if you have a designated space that is not your office, but maybe a desk that's in your living room or maybe, you know, your laptop is on your dining room table when you work. Maybe you're just working from home for a day or maybe this is how it always is. How might someone close that down and what might someone do so that they can almost like, because what I'm kind of getting the sense of, even in that transitionary phase of even changing the clothes, it's almost like a cleansing. It's like, it's almost like this cleaning of the energy before we shift out of it.

JH: So if let's say we use your example that your laptop's on your dining room table and that's where you get a lot of work done. If you plan on having dinner there, you absolutely need to move your laptop and anything associated with work. Especially if you're gonna have dinner with your family. It's really important to be present in those interactions, and it might seem like to you, oh, the laptop's shut. It's on the table, but, like, I'm not involved with it. But it's sending a signal to the rest of the people gathered at the table that work is still present to you, and your work is still present in their lives now. So if you're working at your dining room table, close your laptop and put it somewhere else, even if it's just, like, in a corner of the room on the floor. Just not in your eyesight while you're trying to enjoy a meal with, with your family.

One thing I tell people to do is, let's say you have a desk in your bedroom, there's nowhere else to put it, is to lay something on top of it. If you have a monitor, turn it off. If you have a laptop, close the laptop and maybe slide it into the desk or put it in a drawer. If you can't move it physically, place a shawl over top of it. That's something that I think is so simple, but it is really an act of closing. Like, like you're saying, kinda cleansing it. It's like you're just blanketing the space. When you look at it, you don't see it and think email time or project deadline.

You will see the shawl instead, or the scarf, or the blanket, or whatever you choose. It could be your favorite color, something that makes you feel good or matches your aesthetic. But having that separation visually is really important.

MG: Mhmm. So it sounds like to get a little bit more general here, the objects that are surrounding us regularly, you know, speak to us unconsciously. Maybe that's a little too woo woo to say it that way, but they send unconscious signals to us that we're picking up all the time with our body, with our mind, that maybe we are aware of, or maybe we're not aware of. And so we have, say, a laptop on the dining room table while we're eating, even if it's closed, we're subconsciously gonna be focusing on work and so will everyone else in the room. Yeah?

JH: Yeah. Absolutely. I think, I don't, I mean, I know it does sound a little woo woo, but I think you're absolutely right is that everything around us sends a signal to our brain. Our eyes are taking it in, and then we're processing that, whether that's conscious or unconscious. And in Feng Shui, we think and we know that everything has its own energy–people, pets, objects, trees, inanimate things–they all have their own energy. And in Feng Shui, we kinda label that energy. So specifically for electronics, laptops, TVs, Internet, routers, monitors, anything with, like, a power switch. That's fire energy.

MG: Hmmm.

JH: And that is a very invigorating energy. So, it's great if you wanna sit at your desk and have some fire element to kind of support you, get you going, get into that groove of productivity. But if you're not trying to be in that energy, maybe you wanna be more in the slow moving earth energy, more grounded, covering that fire with something, kind of making it so that you can't see it. So you're not taking that energy in, allows you to make that transition into something more grounding.

MG: Mmm I love this. And it's oh, man, this is so great because if you're trying to relax after work or ground yourself after work, but your laptop is still around you, that's going to be difficult. Or if you're trying to really be present with the people in front of you, that will be difficult. It's actually funny because I was just at my friend's house for dinner on Sunday night, two nights ago, two nights ago from the time of this recording. And she, she works from her dining room table and her laptop was just on the dining room table open. It wasn't even closed, but like the screen was off And we were sitting there eating, and I usually tease her. And so I decided not to tease her this time, and I just let it be there.

And I was like, okay. It's off. It's fine. But what's funny is the conversation inevitably shifted to work. And we talked about work, but we were both really just, like, energized. And I thought it was like, oh, because we're together. But now I'm like, oh, yeah. There's fire energy next to us, and there's, like, subconscious signals that are work related, which, you know, maybe if the laptop weren't there, we wouldn't be 1) maybe we'd be more focused on kind of the food and each other, but 2) we wouldn't be talking about work. I think that's really interesting.

I also have a question. Okay, so not necessarily related to Office Energetics, but since we're talking about fire energy and electronics, when we are winding down for the evening, maybe after a workday, getting ready for bed, or winding down after dinner, what do you think about watching TV then? Since TV is totally like fire energy, even if you watch something maybe a little bit more, I don't know, mindless, something that, you know, because I think a lot of us watch TV to decompress. What does that do to your energy as you're preparing to go to sleep?

JH: Well, I think it depends on what you watch. I will say that. I also watch TV in the evenings to decompress. So if you're watching something super action packed, super suspenseful, that's obviously gonna get your heart rate up. Your blood pressure is gonna be higher. It's gonna be harder for you to disconnect and get that out of your mind when you are closing your eyes and going to sleep. So I think it just depends. TV in the bedroom is something we could talk about.

MG: Yes. Let's talk about it! [both laugh]

JH: Because that's separate. In my opinion, it's different than just watching TV. But a TV in the bedroom that is bringing that energy to the bedroom in a distracting way.

MG: Mhmm.

JH: You might think like, oh, it's giving me energy in the bedroom or invigorating me or something like that. The point of your bedroom and of your bed is to sleep, is for intimacy, and for rest and rejuvenation. It's not for anything else.

And when you start to bring those energies into that space, it confuses conscious or subconscious processing, and it can delay the onset of sleep, or it can disrupt your sleep pattern. In Feng Shui, we don't even recommend keeping anything under the bed. Like our recommendation is to not have anything under the bed because that energy affects you when you're laying on top of it.

Everything you surround yourself with sleep is super important, like, when you're sleeping. So TV in the room, not ideal.

MG: Not ideal.

JH: I know a ton of people have it or do it or watch something on their laptop or, you know, something like that. I would just say if that's the only way you can fall asleep, make sure that it's something that's positive and uplifting, not something that's suspenseful, or stressful, or sad, really emotional.

MG: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's so good. And, you know, sleep is totally veering away from work, but, but sleep does help us work better. We need sleep to to do well, to focus. Sleep is, like, one of the most important things, if not the most important thing that we can do for ourselves and give to ourselves. So I think this is a good tip nonetheless. And, again, I think, you know, the more rested we are, the better we can focus.

Okay. So let's bring it back to the workspace for a second. We have kinda talked a little bit about how objects have energy. And, you know, this energy will send us messages subconsciously or consciously. And as we look at things or sense things around us, it will affect the way that we feel. It will affect the way that we show up.

I mean, I think this is an obvious yes answer, but I, but I wanna dive into this a little bit. You know, does that ultimately affect our results and our deliverables from a work perspective, but also from a life perspective? You know, like, do the objects in the room, for example, help us focus more or maybe distract us such as like a TV in the bedroom at night or a laptop on the dining room table.

Is there a measurable effect or difference in how we might execute on our work depending on what's around us?

JH: Yes. I think so. And in Feng Shui, every aspect of our lives has a different area of the home. So that kinda brings us into the Bagua Map. There's different areas like relationships, health, helpful people, career. There's different areas within the home, and so the, the layout of those rooms, or the furniture within them, the colors within them can enhance or dampen the energy of that area.

So if we're thinking about focus and productivity, we might think about like, if we're gonna start a project and we need to focus, we might think about the new beginnings area of the home. If we need to focus because we need to complete a project, we're gonna think about the completion and creativity area of the home.

So there's different ways to think about what that end result is that you want and how the energy of your home, or your office, or your desk can support you to achieve that.

MG: Oh, yeah. This is good. And so the Bagua Map, we can use this as a guide for maybe how we lay our home out, the colors that we use, the design that we pick, even the objects that we bring into the different areas of our home. Can we also use this directly on our desk or just in maybe one room or one space?

JH: Yes, absolutely. So it's really just a guide and kind of a map in a way. You can lay it flat on any surface. So for the home, you lay it from the front door. From a room, you lay it from the entrance of that room, and then from your desk from where you're seated. So it gives you 9 squares, and it tells you in each square which theme of life they relate to, the color, the element, numbers, the body parts, anything that relates to this particular gua is what they're called. These sections are called guas. So you can put this on your desk and enhance a certain aspect of your life just by moving something into a certain gua.

MG: I love this. Okay. This is pretty deep. We're getting pretty deep. So what I'll say for those listening, I will add, or we will add a little link to a Bagua Map and an explanation of exactly how to use that. So if anyone's interested in actually beginning to create a more harmonious space on their desk or in their office or in their house, you can take that and do that. But I want to run with something that you just said in terms of placing, you know, an object, or placing something in a particular area of our desk where we might want to enhance a particular result. Because in one of the Office Energetics deliveries that we, we did, there was a funny kind of experience.

And so, essentially, what we do in these workshops is we'll talk about Office Energetics all up. We'll kind of go through some general guidelines and principles, which we kinda started to go into today. We'll go into a little bit more of, as well, deeper into this episode. And then we'll also, in the workshop, look at very specific photos and examples of individuals' desks and office spaces. And then Jacey, our resident expert, will pair these photos with their goal and help them basically enhance or optimize their space, or their desk, so that they are more likely to meet their goal.

And the reason I'm saying all of this is because there was one particular delivery that we did where a friend of mine actually joined and participated. And he had this printer, the love and relationship part of his desk. And it was quite funny, but Jacey, you know, mentioned this and she called this out and she was like, are you single? Are you looking for a partner? Like, this is not gonna help you.

JH: It was just like a very antiquated printer, and it was like, he's like, past the desk. [both laugh]

MG: It was so good. It was so good. And, and it's funny though because at the time, he was single, and you mentioned this. And so he made a change to this one area of his desk, the relationship square of his desk, and he actually put a LEGO, kind of like this LEGO object on his desk there instead, which I thought was really interesting. And I, I teased him later because I was checking in to see how things are going and what he changes. Like, oh I, I put this Lego thing there. Now the printer is no longer there. And I was like, oh, are you looking for a Lego girly? Is that what you're trying to call in right now? And super ironically, he had, he was in a a relationship with a girl that was really into Legos.

[laughs] And I was just like, that's just too uncanny, and it's just too uncanny and too funny. I think it's a quite a literal example of now this is gonna sound super woo woo, but how, you know, how we can use objects to enhance the intentions in our lives. And in that also end up calling in the things that we desire.

And so, again, getting super woo woo, but really, you know, thinking about the different things that you surround yourself with on your desk at work, it's not even just about your level of productivity or focus, but it's also about what is it that you're inviting into your life, into your energy, into your space. And it could even be literally.

And so I love, I love this portion of the workshop, and I love when you to dive into the Bagua Map Jacey because I always learn something. So, I just always learn these really cool kind of hacks for how we might, you know, get the things that we want or achieve the goals that we're after.

Like, another example was there was a person who was seeking a promotion in one of our workshops. And you said to put a light, some sort of light in the fame and reputation portion of their desk, which I thought was really cool. Can you talk about that a little bit?

JH: Yeah, sure. I think what I'll say just to kind of summarize your point is that energy, we've been talking about it. It affects us and it loves a purpose. So when I do these workshops or do feng shui for a client, it's about what's the purpose for you? What do you what's your intention? What are you trying to get out of this? So that's why, you know, we were talking in that workshop for that guy. He didn't say his purpose was to find love. I don't remember if he said a purpose specifically, but I just noted that if he was, that he needs to change the energy. And it turns out he was looking for love, so that energy had a purpose then when he made that intentional change on his desk.

So, back to your question about the fame and reputation section, the light there, that, that section is is fire energy. It's the color red. It's a triangle for shape. It's called Li in Chinese. So this space is all about how others see you in the world. And people think like, oh, I don't wanna be famous. I don't need to touch that. Like, that's not for me. Like, I'm not trying to get a 100 followers or, like, be an actress.

But that's not really what it is. Your reputation is how your partner sees you, how your next door neighbor thinks about you, how your boss and your coworkers think about you, how the people at your community center see you. Your reputation is, is how you present yourself in the world and how others receive that presentation. So having a light here just illuminates your, I don't know, your inner qualities, that amazing skill that you have or your personality that really attracts people, things that you're good at. Putting a light here activates this fame and reputation gua, because lights are fire and they bring light to something that you want light to shine on.

MG: Yeah. Oh, that's, that's like what a great way to look at that and what a really beautiful just call out when it comes to fame and reputation because, yeah, I I think you're right. So many people would totally and do totally overlook this part.

I mean, even thinking, you know, like, if I were gonna place the Bagua map down on my desk right now, I don't know that that's something I would necessarily focus on because fame and reputation isn't necessarily my life goal. And you're right, it is like, how do people see me? And I think especially when we're seeking promotion, we need to be seen in our work, in our good work. Right? We need people to recognize us and see us. But even, I don't know, if you were growing a business, for example, visibility is really important. People seeing what it is that you do is really important.

Yeah. Anytime we're working toward a goal, actually, I think it's, it's, it's wise to shine light on that and, and to almost own that. So yeah. Cool. Thanks.

JH: Mhmm.

MG: So we talked a little bit about if someone wanted to optimize their space for promotion. Let's hit on that a little bit more.

JH: Okay.

MG: So there's, you know, putting a light in the fame and reputation portion of the desk. Are there other things that we can do if we wanna get promoted?

JH: Yes. Definitely. So, definitely love the light in the center. Your boss is gonna see you and think of you immediately, like, oh, we have this next role coming up. Okay. Marie looks perfect for that. She just happens to be top of mind. The other option I would say would be helpful people.

This is a, well in the lower right corner, and this is called Kyon. It's metal energy. It is also important for travel, and the color is gray. So for this area, helpful people, if you're looking for promotion, you want people to put in a good word for you. You want people to be in the interview that listen and hear your point of view, can see that you would be great for the job. You want people if you're looking for a, a new job or change, you want someone that would be talking to 1 of their colleagues and says,” oh, I know someone who'd be great for that role.” Or maybe they send you post on LinkedIn or they help you make a connection. These are helpful people that are gonna get you to where you wanna go.

It's networking. This is Feng Shui version of networking. So one thing that you can do to activate this gua, the helpful people gua, is to make a point to meet 9 new people every day for 9 days, or if you want an intense challenge, 27 days. These are very lucky numbers in Feng Shui.

And the 9 people don't necessarily have to be, like, work related at work. It could be anybody. You can just say hello to your neighbor or the person in the grocery line, but just putting yourself out there and allowing that opportunity of meeting helpful people, allow that to come into your life. So that's the challenge.

I would, I would put that challenge out there. I'd love to hear if anybody does that. So that's like an active thing that you can do to invite helpful people. But, also, this is gray color, metal energy. So in this area, we could talk about different things that you might add depending on where that space lands for you. I think in our workshop, we talked about putting your phone there just because that's how you communicate with people, helpful people in your life. So communication is really important. And most of our phones are made of metal, so I think everyone’s phone is made of metal. So if your phone is there, you're bringing that into that area and activating that energy.

MG: I love it. So phone bottom right part of your desk as you're working.

JH: Yeah. There used to be, like, I had a book that was maybe from the eighties or something, and they said to put your Rolodex there.

[both laugh]

JH: We don't have those anymore, so…

MG: I like it. I like this though because, you know, in the way that we live today, we are on our phones a lot. And it would be hard to be at work on our desk without having our phone alongside us. And so having a place for that phone to live, I think is really cool. Because it's not only are we giving ourselves permission to have it, but then we're giving ourselves permission to have it and to almost, like, get double productivity use out of it. There's like the use of the phone, but then there's also the use of, you know, where we're placing it, the intention and calling in more helpful people and better communication and networking. I love that.

I also love what you said about meeting people. So this is the first time that I've heard you give a Feng Shui challenge that was outside of the house, or away from the space, right? And it's really cool because I think this reminds us that, you know, our energy energies are connected always.

Right? And so how we be in a space or outside of the space is, is almost just as important as the space itself. We're kind of like a mirror to what's around us, and what's around us is kind of a mirror back to us. And so I think it's always really important to be, I don't know, maybe acting in alignment with some of the things that we like, too.

And just this is cool because, like, what a cool fun hack that almost seemingly has nothing to do with maybe talking to your boss and asking them for promotion, but that could potentially affect and adjust your energy so that you could be more ready and/or recommended for, you know, the next step in your career.

JH: Mhmm.

MG: So cool. Okay. So let's keep checking out promotion for a second, and then I wanna switch to other things that we might optimize for. But because this is something we always talk about every single workshop, when we wanna get promoted or not in general, I think this is a good principle to operate from. Does it matter where our desk is placed and where our chair is placed and how we're sitting?

JH: I would say yes. I don't wanna say that it would exclude you from a promotion if your desk is placed, like, adversely, but if you're looking for a promotion and you want it now, there is something you can do in your space that would put you in position to feel powerful and ready to receive.

So that's what we're talking about the command position. We talk about this a lot in our workshops. The command position is super important in life but especially at work and especially in your office space when you wanna feel powerful and in command of your life and in command of your work.

So this is how I describe it. I always describe it the same in the workshops. But if you think about, like, a mob boss in a movie, they're always at a big table in the back where they can see everything around them and they can see all doors. And when you walk into that restaurant or the character walks into the restaurant, eye contact is made immediately, and you know who's in charge.

So, moving your desk to face the door so that you can see who's coming in and out is how you can present yourself to be in command position. It'd be ideal if you could see a window and a door, but most importantly, it would be the door. If you are sitting at your desk and your back is towards the door, you don't really know what's going on behind you, and subconsciously that is putting you on alert. Whether, again, it's subconscious, like, you might you're not gonna be aware of that feeling, but it is something that's kind of just nagging you at the back and not allowing full presence, full focus because you never know what's gonna come through that door and if someone's gonna come in and chop your head off. You just don't know, and you won't know unless you're facing the door.

[both laugh]

JH: So command position is important for feeling powerful, feeling in control, and knowing what's ahead, having, like, ambition and seeing what's gonna come for you and being ready to take on those challenges.

And if you can't change your desk to face the door, one thing we've talked about is putting a mirror on the desk or even, like, a small circular mirror at the corner of your monitor or something that you can glance at and you can see behind you. So it reflects what's going on behind you. And, also, that you said a tip in one of the workshops that I really liked when we were talking about this, about having a mirror on the desk, it holds you to a higher accountability or something.

MG: Mmm…standard, yeah.

JH: Yeah. Yeah. I liked when you said that. What was that?

MG: Yeah. Yeah. So, so I have a mirror on my desk because my my door is behind me because my office is small and I like the way that it is this way. So I have a mirror that I can see not only the door behind me, but also I can see my front door. So I can see all the doors pretty much into my house coming into my office, which feels really good and safe. But also, occasionally, I'll look over and I can see myself. And research will show us that when we watch ourselves do something, or when we see ourselves in a mirror doing something, it holds us to a higher standard or higher level of, like, personal integrity, honesty, fairness, truth. Like, you're more likely to tell the truth if you can see yourself.

You're more likely to do a more thorough job if you can see yourself. You're more likely to just show up in the person that you would like to become or the person that you would like to see yourself as, if you can physically see yourself. So having a mirror on the desk not only helps you, you know, subconsciously safety wise if there's a door behind you. But even if there's not a door behind you, having a small mirror on your desk can really help you just remember who it is that you wanna be, and it can help you show up in that more and more consciously or subconsciously, whether or not you see yourself. Kind of a, kind of cool tip.

JH: Yeah. I love that. And it's double meaning.

MG: Mhmm.

JH: So it's supportive in all ways.

MG: So good. Okay. Cool. Okay. So alright. Let's, let's shift away from promotion for a second. So if someone wanted to optimize their space for, say, work life balance, what are some things that we can do either I mean, we talked a little bit about closing the office door, closing down our work, but even I think while we're working, are there things that we can do to create more balance?

JH: Yeah, definitely. I think, so definitely, first things first, you gotta make the separation. Like that's my number one tip for sure. If we are focusing specifically on something else in our lives that is important to us, activating the energy of that space on your desk or in your office would be really important.

And I would say that the center gua, which is called Tai Chi, so it's the one gua that touches all the others, is important for health, and for balance. So this gua touches purpose and career. It touches relationships. It touches fame and recognition, and it touches knowledge.

So all, like and all the other ones. I can name them all. But it touches everything. So having this space free of clutter allows that balance and that evenness in the center of your life that helps to support all of the other things you have going on.

MG: So the centric wall, that's the very dead center of your desk. Right?

JH: Right. That's center of your desk, dead center of the room, dead center of the house.

MG: Awesome. And so we definitely don't want junk to accumulate there if we want more like balance.

JH: No junk. And the other thing I will say is, on one of our workshops, we had someone and they had their laptop there and they told us that their goal was work life balance. And I said, that's not gonna be helpful. If your goal is work life balance, then putting your main working source in the center of your balance gua, it's gonna create that focus on work. You're not gonna have the other things to flow through it.

MG: Mhmm. Oh, this is funny because the person who said that is a client of mine, and [laughs] she does work all the time. [laughs] She is always working and always thinking about work. So that's, like, that's quite funny because that's, like, a great great example.

Okay, I also wanna talk about okay. Activating, you said activating the energy on the desk that we wanna focus on. So, if we want work life balance and we wanna spend, say, maybe more time with families, so maybe we are you know, we want more work life balance because we're not spending enough time with our family, whether that's our immediate family or, like, your parents or siblings or close friends, what can we do for that? Are you saying we would activate like the relationships portion of our, or like the family area of our desk, or like, maybe placing a photo of the family, would that help? Where might we do that? What would that look like?

JH: Okay. Yes. So the, there are two separate ones here, the relationship gua and then the new beginnings gua, which is associated with family. So these are two separate spaces. The relationship one is on the back right corner. This one is earth energy. It is pink colored and square in shape, and its number is 2 as in partners. And then for the new beginnings side would be on the left in the middle, and it's green.

And it has kinda like pillars, two rectangular pillars side by side. That's the shape. Its number is 3, and it's a wood element. It's called Zen, and relationships is called Kun. So if we're thinking about family in the sense of, like, your nuclear family, including your partner, your kids, maybe your parents, siblings. That left side middle would be a place to activate. If you're more so thinking about relationships, like friendships and intimate partnership, then the relationship section would be more pertinent. So the relationship area is really about love in all forms. So, self love is also important for this area, friendship love, family love, and romantic love.

You can choose between the two, or you can do both. So I can give tips for each one if you'd like?

MG: Yeah. Let's do it.

JH: Okay. So for the relationship area, what I really love to see here is a pair of objects because the number is 2, and it activates like a pair as a partner. So a vase with two flowers, or two, if you did, like, two rose quartz because its earth element is stones. So you could do two rose quartz. You could do two candles. You could do something that is just in a pair. Like two things that you like, two Lego pieces. [both laugh] If he wants to call in a LEGO partner, two of them together holding hands or something, that would be perfect. So that would be the best thing there. Also pink. So a pink flower, pink rose quartz, those…those are kind of similar examples.

And so then in the new beginnings area, this is wood energy and plants are wood energy. So a plant here is really beneficial. The ideal plant is bamboo in Feng Shui. Of course, yeah, that's the Chinese thing. So the upward growth, you can go to, I think they even sold them at Home Depot recently, but there's, like, like, those little bamboo shoots in a small pot. And if you could just get a few of those, three of them, that would be be ideal. And they grow straight up, and they have that kind of upward pillar style that this gua that's, like, representative of its energy. So that would be something to bring there, or a family of objects.

So I think in one of our workshops, we talked about office supplies as a grouping.

MG: Mhmm.

JH: So all of your paper clips, family paper clips, or all of your pens and highlighters in this area as kind of a family in one area. And a picture of your family would also be a reasonable thing to add.

MG: Mhmm.

JH: I mentioned just a picture of us or kids together. You're like, you know, if you do your Christmas card or something or you, you have a family photo shoot every year, this would be a perfect place to put it. And I'll also say I should have added that for relationships.

If you are in partnership, a picture of yourself and your partner is perfect in this area. If you're not in partnership and you wanna highlight friendships, a picture of yourself with your friends is also great for that area.

MG: Something that I love too about the placement of objects on our desk when we start to work with the Bagua map, which, again, will link a Bagua map and some instructions for anyone listening to this, and you're just like, wait. What's where do things go?

But something that I love about this is when we do place, say, a photo of us and our friends or a photo of us and our friends or a photo of us and a partner or a photo of our family or when we place even a family of pens onto our desk, especially the intentional placement of it, now that you're listening to this, you're like, oh, I want more work life balance. I wanna spend more time with family. I'm gonna put this thing in this one particular at my desk.

What's cool about it is every day when you sit down to work at your desk, you're reminded of this desire for balance that you want or that you're seeking. And so in so many ways, again, we have that mirroring experience where not only are we calling that energy in, but we're reflecting it back and it's getting reflected back at us. And then it allows us to, you know, maybe shut the computer down at 4:30, or show up for our kids baseball game, or meet our friends out for a drink when normally we wouldn't do that because we're tired after work. Right?

And so I love I don't know. I just love this work for so many different reasons, but I love that that element of self awareness that comes in too. Okay. So what if we want to prioritize or optimize our space for health or wellness? Kind of similar to work life balance, but maybe a little bit more personal.

JH: Well, that would be the Tai Chi Center. So that is where you focus, where the focus for health would go. And making sure that it is clear is probably the best thing you can do. When your body is in optimal condition. Everything is pumping correctly. All of your levels are appropriate. You can breathe free and clearly, making sure that your meridians are open and flowing. That's the Chinese medicine thing, and Feng Shui is actually part of Chinese medicine.

But making sure that your energy is open, ready to receive, energized, invigorated, that's gonna be part of that center area. So just wanting it to be open is probably the best thing. If you wanted to bring something specific there, the color is yellow or like a burnt yellow. It's earth energy. So you could bring those colors or, like a, a yellow rock or something, a stone there to really highlight it. But I honestly feel like especially in a desk because it is the middle of the desk, just keeping it open is probably the best thing for your health.

MG: So we, we kinda talked about some examples for things that we might optimize for. By the way, the specific questions that I asked you, Jacey, were questions based on the things that we get most asked at our workshops. These are the things that people mostly share with us in terms of goals. Typically, people are, like, looking for promotion, looking to make more money, looking for a greater work life balance, looking for health and wellness. I'm curious though, what are some other goals that you've helped people work to optimize for? And then do they have to be work related or how far reaching can we take this? So, so maybe not just what are some of the other goals that you've helped people with, but what have been some of your favorite goals that you've helped people with or that you've been able to advise on?

JH: I have a few that come to mind. One that was really fun was my friend really wanted to start a family. And so we went around her house and optimized her house for child energy. Not like we baby-proofed it. We didn't, like, put toys out all around, but we did a clearing and we discussed how certain aspects of the home relate to the energy of creation and optimizing her physical health in that journey as well. So we touched on the completion creation children's gua and the Tai Chi Center Health Gua for her specifically, but we also talked a lot about the rest of her house. We did a whole thing for her, and she has a baby now.

MG: That's so exciting!

JH: Yeah. So that was really fun. So I liked that one. One thing that people talk a lot about is abundance.

MG: Mhmm.

JH: The abundance gua, we haven't talked about that yet. But that there is a specific area in the Bogua map for abundance. And that's abundance of all things, but wealth very specifically. And that is in the back left corner

MG: Mhmm.

JH: Of the desk. And this is also wood element and the color is purple, but also metallics can can go here like golden coins or things like that would be great. And wood elements would be plants again and specific plants, ones with rounded leaves like coins. So pilea would be great. And the number is 4. So anything in a group of four would be good. So that's, these are some things that I feel like I work with a lot of people on. Everyone wants more money. So that's a very common one. Even if that's not someone's primary focus, we always touch on that that area just, just for fun.

MG: Yeah. Who doesn't want more abundance and more wealth in their life? Cool. Yeah. This is awesome. So, okay, if we bring this back to a team or organization, why do you think this is beneficial for teams? And, like, why do you think this is beneficial for teams other than the insights themselves? Like, have you seen in our, in our work together now, do you think that this is a valuable experience and why? What are some things you've observed?

JH: I feel like I observe people connecting to their colleagues a lot. Especially the teams that have a lot of remote workers.

MG: Mmmm.

JH: It's so intimate when we're doing the workshop and people send in a picture of their workspace. You can be on video calls all day, but you don't know what someone's desk truly looks like. You're only seeing what's behind their head.

MG: Mhmm.

JH: But having that experience of being like, oh, at her desk, she has a blanket on her chair or this person has a picture of their kids here or anything like that. I think it's…it just kind of is an insight into each other's daily lives that you wouldn't otherwise get to see. And it's just a way for people to connect.

And I feel like everyone kinda talks in the chat and they can compare things like, oh, I have that too or, you know, I just see in the chat people are always kind of, like, talking to each other, and I like that.

MG: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What I will say to add to that is in all of the workshops that I do through Essential Teams, or even TCP, The Corporate Psychic, for corporate teams, office energetics is by far the most engaging workshop that we deliver. Like by far! I think, I think this is for so many reasons. One, it's, it's different. It's an unconventional way to look at our space. It's like super inviting. It's really light. It's really fun. Jacey and I were not too serious when we deliver it. We kind of bounce off of each other quite a lot, but you learn so much in such a light, fun setting.

And then, yeah, exactly what you said. You get to see your colleagues' homes. You get to see, you know, their desks. You get to see elements of them that you normally wouldn't see, and you get to connect on those things.

And that's exactly what I observed as well. I think by, like, you know, by far, it's, it's immensely engaging. Just people are constantly in the chat. Jacey and I have only delivered the workshop together. We've never been separate during the workshop. And I think, actually, after having done it a few times, it's necessary because the chat is so busy that, Jacey, you actually need a moderator. [laughs] You can't do both because people are just so excited talking about things, asking a lot of questions, and then we just get such, you know, wonderful questions. And, yeah, it's such a connective and cool experience, where I think people leave with a lot of really insightful information as well, and can kind of take things and implement them right away.

I think that's what's also cool about Office Energetics is that, you know, it's it's very tangible even though, you know, some of the concepts are a little bit woo woo. Like, we're talking about the energy within objects. Although, we don't always get that woo woo in the workshops, but the the foundation of this work is pretty, it's pretty out there. From normal standards, I don't think it's really out there at all, I think it makes a lot of sense. But, you know, despite that, it's super tangible. So, you know, even you looking at a photo of somebody's desk and saying, you can place a light here or put a family of pens there or, hey, that thing that's on the left corner of your desk, move it to the right corner of your desk.

Or, like, there was this one woman who had plants everywhere, but she didn't have the plants in the abundance area. And so you were like, hey, you can actually shift these over here and, like, your energy is gonna change.

And it's cool because it's tangible and then people because it's so tangible and material, people can actually experiment. And so I love to just suggest to people of, like, okay, just move the thing and see what happens, like, with Tyler and the Legos. You know, it's like actually putting something there and seeing what happens and seeing what you call in and then, you know, shifting things around and seeing what happens and seeing what you call in and seeing how you feel and seeing what your experiences, I think is so cool. And then even just generating the awareness of not only the intentions that we put into the world, but the way that the world affects us on a regular basis so that we can make better decisions about what is in our space. So, yeah, I don't know. I think it's pretty good.

JH: Well, people learn from each other too. Even if it's not even if I'm not talking about their specific desk while we're taught like, that's not the picture in front of us. You and I are adding so much about the elements on the desk or we go off onto something else and talk about how to enhance in the home or something. That allows people to make connections that maybe that they weren't expecting to make while they were there.

They're thinking they came in with a specific purpose. They gave us their one goal. We were gonna talk about that, and then we would move on. But they learn so much more, and they're able to bring home a lot of other things, not just for their office.

MG: Yeah. Oh, such a good point. What else? What else, what else is there? Is there anything anything that you can think of that you would wanna add or anything that you would wanna know when it comes or you would want other people to know when it comes to, mmm, I would say, Office Energetics, Home Energetics, Feng Shui, our environments and how they make us feel, anything coming to you?

JH: Yeah. I think that when people hear Feng Shui, a lot of times they get intimidated. And a lot of times they think it's all about just getting rid of everything they own and living super minimalist and, like, no clutter and you can't keep your collectibles and I'm gonna tell you to throw everything away. And that's really not it at all. It's just about how yeah, it's about how the energy that you have around you can support you. And if there's something that you really love about having like 25 figurines, that's perfectly fine. Like, that's great. That's something that you love that brings you joy. I'm not gonna tell you you need to get rid of them or pair it down to 5.

MG: How can people find you? What is it that you're working on now outside of Office Energetics with, with me and through Essential Teams? You have some other things that you do. So do you wanna invite anyone in?

JH: Sure. So I, yeah, I do Office Energetics with you, which is so fun, but also I do feng shui for a whole homes, and I work with people very intimately and it is very intentional. I don't have a specific package or offering that I have, like, listed on a website.

It's really just if people reach out and we kinda come up with what they need. So my website is the best place to see me and reach me, read my blog. So that's stilljacey.com. And I do write a newsletter and I write a blog on occasion. I'm not super consistent with it, I will say, but it is probably the best way to get updates from me, and kind of see what I'm up to, and understand what I'm working on and other things.

Aside from the Feng Shui stuff, I have just completed a health coaching certification. [both laugh] Yeah. I'm really excited about that. I am, I'm a nurse nurse practitioner, so I've always been in the health space, but this is a different way for me to provide just guidance and support to people on their own health and wellness journeys. And it's a little more holistic than my current roles as a health care practitioner. So, I'm really excited about that and I write a lot about that on my blog and in my newsletter. Just about general health and wellness tips and how people can optimize their lives to feel the best, be the best version of themselves.

MG: I love this so much, Jacey, because you, you have such an incredible wheelhouse maybe or tool set of skills. Toolbox maybe is the right word, of tools that you can pull out in terms of health and wellness and just how you can, you know, holistically support someone in a really integrated way.

You know, I think about your experience, like, as a nurse practitioner, but then also your experience with the energy around us, which affects our health, your experience with, like, herbalism and herbs, your experience now with, like, health and wellness in a different type of way. And so I'm really excited to see what what comes of this. And I hope everyone anyone listening who feels the call, you know, reaches out and to learn more.

JH: Thanks. Yeah. I'm excited to hear from some of your people. I know you have such a wonderful community, so I'm really honored to be here. So thank you so much for inviting me.

MG: You're so welcome. Thank you so much for coming!

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Thank you so much for listening to The Spiritual 9-5 Podcast. I'm your host, Marie Groover, and I am beyond honored that you are here.

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Until next time, big love.

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Shownotes

Can reorganizing your desk improve your salary, energy, and work-life balance? We think so.

Jacey Herbert is a meditation leader and eternal spiritual student living in Washington, DC, USA. She is the owner of Stillness and Wonder, a small business that offers energetic services (think Feng Shui + spiritual magic), intuitive readings, and meditations.

Marie and Jacey co-facilitate Office Energetics workshops for teams, and in this episode, they explain how objects have different energies and why feng-shuiing your desk can transform your life.

Chapters:

4:00 The importance of having a designated workspace

9:00 The elemental energies of objects

15:00 How to use a bagua map

25:00 How to optimize your workspace for a promotion

35:00 Changing your space for better work-life balance

43:15 Prioritizing health and wellness in your workspace

48:00 How office energetics benefits teams

References: